15 Tachwedd 2022 , Business Committee
Diwygio'r Senedd
Yes? Is that okay?
15 Tachwedd 2022 , Business Committee
Diwygio'r Senedd
Mae'n siŵr y byddai'n rhaid newid i fersiwn Gymraeg, achos 'Presiding Officer' yw'r term ar hyn o bryd yn y ddeddfwriaeth, felly byddai'n rhaid gwneud newid—p'un ai ydy'r newid yna i 'Llywydd' yn y Gymraeg ac yn y Saesneg neu a ydy'r newid yna i 'Llywydd' a…
15 Tachwedd 2022 , Business Committee
Diwygio'r Senedd
Okay. So, a maximum of two. And then, just on the name, I end up, obviously, calling myself Llywydd, and that's the term I use. But, for people from outside of Wales primarily, that's unfamiliar to them, so I call myself a Presiding Officer. And then, all of…
15 Tachwedd 2022 , Business Committee
Diwygio'r Senedd
Do we think that we're getting to a consensus with a maximum of two? But then, obviously, it will be for the next Senedd to decide on that. And, this is always, of course, subject to a vote. The Standing Orders would reflect the need to vote two Deputy…
15 Tachwedd 2022 , Business Committee
Diwygio'r Senedd
Okay. That's good. Anything else? What's proposed there is slightly different to what was said by Labour, and probably Plaid Cymru, but possibly achieves the same thing, which is you set a maximum of two deputy speakers. The politics of the time, possibly…
15 Tachwedd 2022 , Business Committee
Diwygio'r Senedd
Okay, let's do the numbers first then. Darren, do you have a view on this?
15 Tachwedd 2022 , Business Committee
Diwygio'r Senedd
Yes. I can see that there's a logic to 12 being a minimum, because it is the current Government, but I don't know why we would want to introduce a minimum that is higher than 12 in the legislation. A Government could bring forward a Government that is between…
15 Tachwedd 2022 , Business Committee
Diwygio'r Senedd
The other option that could be available to us is to have a maximum that is somewhere towards the middle of this, of 16, say, which is the Labour group proposal in the written form, but with a possibility of a two-thirds vote, a supermajority vote, up to 19…
15 Tachwedd 2022 , Business Committee
Diwygio'r Senedd
I'm putting officials on the spot there, but it's certainly something we can look at in terms of a minimum number.
15 Tachwedd 2022 , Business Committee
Diwygio'r Senedd
Can I just be clear, then, why there should be a minimum? I'm not quite understanding the concept of why a minimum is necessary.
15 Tachwedd 2022 , Business Committee
Diwygio'r Senedd
Okay. Fine. I think we've rehearsed all the issues. I think there's an agreement that there should be an upper limit in the legislation. There is some disagreement as to whether there should be a minimum and what that minimum should be, so we need to further…
15 Tachwedd 2022 , Business Committee
Diwygio'r Senedd
Lesley.
15 Tachwedd 2022 , Business Committee
Diwygio'r Senedd
Mae'n cynyddu'r absolute numbers, ond dyw e ddim yn cynyddu'r percentage, nac ydy? Darren.
15 Tachwedd 2022 , Business Committee
Diwygio'r Senedd
Ydy, ond dyw e ddim yn cynyddu'r ratio o sgrwtini versus Llywodraeth, nac ydy? Mae'n cadw'r ratio yr un peth.
15 Tachwedd 2022 , Business Committee
Diwygio'r Senedd
Wel, ydyn—
15 Tachwedd 2022 , Business Committee
Diwygio'r Senedd
Byddwn i jest yn ein hatgoffa ni eto o brif bwrpas gwneud hyn i gyd. Yn yr holl dystiolaeth allanol ac adroddiad Laura McAllister, rydyn ni wedi gweld yr angen i gryfhau sgrwtini ac nid o anghenraid chwyddo'r Llywodraeth i 19.
15 Tachwedd 2022 , Business Committee
Diwygio'r Senedd
Ie, o ran proportionality—
15 Tachwedd 2022 , Business Committee
Diwygio'r Senedd
Yr unig beth byddwn i'n dweud am roi minimwm yw y gallech chi weld rhyw Lywodraeth yn cael ei ffurfio yn dilyn maniffesto sydd wedi dweud, 'Rŷn ni eisiau shrincio Llywodraeth yng Nghymru, ac rŷn ni eisiau llai o Weinidogion er mwyn creu gwell sefyllfa'. Wedyn…
15 Tachwedd 2022 , Business Committee
Diwygio'r Senedd
Fe wnawn ni orffen ar hyn y bore yma gyda'r ffaith bod gosod mwyafswm mewn Deddf yn rhywbeth i'w anelu ato, yn debyg i'r Ddeddf sydd gyda ni ar hyn o bryd, a bod y mwyafswm hwnnw o bosib yn 19, sef yn adlewyrchu proportionality. Nid yw pawb yn cytuno ar…
15 Tachwedd 2022 , Business Committee
Diwygio'r Senedd
You're the one who said there shouldn't be a minimum, and I'm agreeing with you, Darren. I know that's unusual territory, but not unusual in the Business Committee, maybe. We don't have a minimum currently, remember, so we only currently have a maximum of 12…
15 Tachwedd 2022 , Business Committee
Diwygio'r Senedd
Yes, which isn't the case in our current setup. That would be a means of confirming the number, then, as well as the names that would be given at that point, I'm guessing. I'm hearing that there is some support for a minimum of 16, but not by you, Darren. I…
15 Tachwedd 2022 , Business Committee
Diwygio'r Senedd
Thank you for telling me that I was right in referring to Scotland and that there is some kind of voting process, or that the Government is voted in by the Parliament—yes?
15 Tachwedd 2022 , Business Committee
Diwygio'r Senedd
Oh, we've seen quite a few. [Laughter.] Yes, Jane.
15 Tachwedd 2022 , Business Committee
Diwygio'r Senedd
You never know, with independent-thinking Government backbenchers, what that vote might bring up.
15 Tachwedd 2022 , Business Committee
Diwygio'r Senedd
Yes, you're right. The Welsh Government did say that as well.
