, Legislation, Justice and Constitution Committee
Scrutiny session with the Counsel General and Minister for the Constitution
That might work in theory in terms of one of the models. Part of the problem is this. Firstly, if, say, for example, the issue is lack of engagement and there's a dispute over that—'You haven't engaged with us properly over this really important piece of…
, Legislation, Justice and Constitution Committee
Scrutiny session with the Counsel General and Minister for the Constitution
A very good question. I don't think there is a clear answer to that at the moment. We have the arrangements as part of the inter-governmental agreement from just over a year and a half ago. Of course, part of the purpose to having it is to actually provide a…
, Legislation, Justice and Constitution Committee
Scrutiny session with the Counsel General and Minister for the Constitution
So, we declare at three o'clock.
, Legislation, Justice and Constitution Committee
Scrutiny session with the Counsel General and Minister for the Constitution
Could I add one point? Of course, there are various databases or sources of data that are not part of any strategic structure. So, we know within the prison service, in terms of the detailed analysis they've done in terms of everyone who is within the prison…
, Legislation, Justice and Constitution Committee
Scrutiny session with the Counsel General and Minister for the Constitution
I think all these things also begin to produce their own data—the anti-racism blueprint that the Minister for Social Justice has been involved in, and so on. But in terms of ongoing, the actual data structural process—.
, Legislation, Justice and Constitution Committee
Scrutiny session with the Counsel General and Minister for the Constitution
I agree with that. I think we're still getting to grips with the data that we're beginning to get, the picture we're beginning to get. For example, the work with Cardiff University, which was predominantly based, as I understand it, on freedom of information…
, Legislation, Justice and Constitution Committee
Scrutiny session with the Counsel General and Minister for the Constitution
The last point you make there is fundamental; if you want to make changes and improvements, you have to understand what is actually happening, which means you have to have that core data, particularly if you're looking at reform. Again, the issue of data is…
, Legislation, Justice and Constitution Committee
Scrutiny session with the Counsel General and Minister for the Constitution
Well, firstly, I was glad that Lord Bellamy, as a UK Government Minister, attended, because it was a specific request that he should go and see for himself. We had raised it with his predecessors and with the previous Lord Chancellor without, in fact, any…
, Legislation, Justice and Constitution Committee
Scrutiny session with the Counsel General and Minister for the Constitution
—other than, I think, the issue of the independence of the judicial system, which we'd be setting up through tribunal reform, the independence of that is what is determined in the legislation and the Senedd decides what its view is on how that should operate…
, Legislation, Justice and Constitution Committee
Scrutiny session with the Counsel General and Minister for the Constitution
The answer is: I don't really know what the answer is to that—[Laughter.]—
, Legislation, Justice and Constitution Committee
Scrutiny session with the Counsel General and Minister for the Constitution
The answer is: I'm not really certain one way or the other over this. What I can say is that my personal thinking on this is disinclined towards the idea that Senedd Members would take an oath on something like this. I think it's what they have in Scotland. I…
, Legislation, Justice and Constitution Committee
Scrutiny session with the Counsel General and Minister for the Constitution
Oh, listen, absolutely. The White Paper is a genuine White Paper consultation where we want to hear the input of those who have expertise within the area, who may have views on it, who may have practical experience as to how one or other different models…
, Legislation, Justice and Constitution Committee
Scrutiny session with the Counsel General and Minister for the Constitution
No, I'll bring James in in a minute, because he's given a lot of thought to that. There are no specific reasons other than the fundamental principle that, whatever model you choose, there are different models you could create. They have to be independent of…
, Legislation, Justice and Constitution Committee
Scrutiny session with the Counsel General and Minister for the Constitution
Thank you for those questions. In terms of divergence, first of all with the White Paper, there's got to be scope within it for options for consideration. So, the questions in the White Paper are often presented in a way that invite either approval of a…
, Legislation, Justice and Constitution Committee
Scrutiny session with the Counsel General and Minister for the Constitution
Well, the answer is 'yes', and this is an ongoing discussion and debate that we're going to have that I hope will be hardened by a strong evidential base, which is what I've been talking about with regard to the work that's going on. But, just to give you…
, Legislation, Justice and Constitution Committee
Scrutiny session with the Counsel General and Minister for the Constitution
Well, I think the answer is 'I don't know', because I think that is still very much work in progress. One of the things that will be happening, and I do want to happen, of course, is that I want to have further round-tables in terms of the discussion, so we…
, Legislation, Justice and Constitution Committee
Scrutiny session with the Counsel General and Minister for the Constitution
Well, it is a good question, and, of course, it is not only work in progress but continual work in progress, because of the changing environment in which we exist, and we've seen events that occur. But, for example, the integral role of policing and all the…
, Legislation, Justice and Constitution Committee
Scrutiny session with the Counsel General and Minister for the Constitution
The actual work that we're doing now is all contained within existing budgets. A lot of it is work that is actually being volunteered by specialists—people from those sectors who are so concerned and interested in this area that they are actually volunteering…
, Legislation, Justice and Constitution Committee
Scrutiny session with the Counsel General and Minister for the Constitution
Well, if devolution is eventually devolved in whatever format, then, obviously, the cost of that has to be devolved. It has to follow the devolution. That is an absolute fundamental. How that is worked out, obviously, is something that would be a requirement…
, Legislation, Justice and Constitution Committee
Scrutiny session with the Counsel General and Minister for the Constitution
Well, obviously, the perception of policing has a long, long history at UK level. In many ways, the current adverse perceptions are, I think, part of the reasoning why we should actually be pressing for the devolution of policing. Putting all that to one…
, Legislation, Justice and Constitution Committee
Scrutiny session with the Counsel General and Minister for the Constitution
Yes. If it is to happen, these sorts of changes need to happen very early on, otherwise, they get delayed and caught up in all sorts of other priorities. It's an important one to us, it's one we have been arguing for, certainly nearly all the time that I've…
, Legislation, Justice and Constitution Committee
Scrutiny session with the Counsel General and Minister for the Constitution
Thank you. Firstly, I very much welcome the fact that we have her services on board for 12 months. She's an individual with an outstanding legal record. She is a former victims' commissioner appointed by UK Government, a former Member of Parliament. But I…
, Plenary
Debate on a Member's Legislative Proposal—A civic duty to vote Bill
Diolch, Dirprwy Lywydd. Can I thank Adam Price for introducing this thoughtful and important legislative proposal? As Members will know, I have often referred to the importance of our nation's democratic health in Senedd debates, and I believe that, alongside…
, Plenary
Statement by the Counsel General and Minister for the Constitution: Tribunal reform and Wales’s evolving justice landscape
Thank you for that. The Member is right, of course, to, again, raise, as others have, the issue of policing. Policing is an integral part of the justice system. In many ways, much of the operation of policing is devolved in a hybrid way in terms of the fact…
, Plenary
Statement by the Counsel General and Minister for the Constitution: Tribunal reform and Wales’s evolving justice landscape
Thank you, Rhys, for those comments. In terms of the timetable, I think you heard the First Minister earlier today say that, not within the third year, but before the end, there will be a Bill that will be introduced. It's not for me to say precisely what…
