26 Ebrill 2023 , Finance Committee
Bil yr Amgylchedd (Ansawdd Aer a Seinweddau) (Cymru)
Yes. So, the current requirements are to review and update our plan in relation to certain types of noise every five years, and that's for major roads, major railways, transport and industrial noises. There is currently no statutory requirement to publish…
26 Ebrill 2023 , Finance Committee
Bil yr Amgylchedd (Ansawdd Aer a Seinweddau) (Cymru)
Yes, sure.
26 Ebrill 2023 , Finance Committee
Bil yr Amgylchedd (Ansawdd Aer a Seinweddau) (Cymru)
So, again, I'm really sorry—I really don't want to come to a committee and just tell you, 'I don't know' constantly, but, again, it's really difficult to calculate that, as it depends on the location and the particular scheme again. I mean, the devil in this…
26 Ebrill 2023 , Finance Committee
Bil yr Amgylchedd (Ansawdd Aer a Seinweddau) (Cymru)
So, as I said, what we're expecting is that—. Well, first of all, the local authority will be able to authorise any of its officers to enforce this. So, it doesn't have to be a particular class of officer, and that will be very much a matter for the local…
26 Ebrill 2023 , Finance Committee
Bil yr Amgylchedd (Ansawdd Aer a Seinweddau) (Cymru)
So, again, this is the clean air Act stuff. So, that has a 70 per cent burden on a local authority or the Welsh Government if they implement it. The assumption is that 30 per cent will be covered by members of the public affected. Given the current…
26 Ebrill 2023 , Finance Committee
Bil yr Amgylchedd (Ansawdd Aer a Seinweddau) (Cymru)
In developing the guidance, John, we will absolutely be working with the local authorities. We can't do it without them. We absolutely need their expertise to do it. So, they will be helping us develop the guidance. They're much better placed to do that for…
26 Ebrill 2023 , Finance Committee
Bil yr Amgylchedd (Ansawdd Aer a Seinweddau) (Cymru)
We hope that it will encourage local authorities to take a much more holistic approach to tackling poor air quality in their area, including consideration of smoke control areas, but we've based the calculations in the Bill around existing smoke control areas…
26 Ebrill 2023 , Finance Committee
Bil yr Amgylchedd (Ansawdd Aer a Seinweddau) (Cymru)
Yes, so the way we've done this is we've asked local authorities directly for their costs, and we've used costs outlined in the local authority air quality action plans, and we've used bids submitted to pilot phases of the local air quality management support…
26 Ebrill 2023 , Finance Committee
Bil yr Amgylchedd (Ansawdd Aer a Seinweddau) (Cymru)
Yes, pretty much, really. So, at the moment, the legislation says that we only have to consult Natural Resources Wales. That's the only absolute requirement at the moment. That's not what we do, but that's the only absolute requirement. So, this Bill proposes…
26 Ebrill 2023 , Finance Committee
Bil yr Amgylchedd (Ansawdd Aer a Seinweddau) (Cymru)
Yes, so it's one of the things, isn't it? One of the things we want is to be able to have the right data to get the right solution in particular areas. What else can I say to that, really? So, if a diversion around an area is a way to solve the air quality…
26 Ebrill 2023 , Finance Committee
Bil yr Amgylchedd (Ansawdd Aer a Seinweddau) (Cymru)
For sure, and we want this to work. So, if we're doing a national air quality strategy, then we'll be consulting with our local authority colleagues, and, as part of the consultation, they always raise, 'If this puts a duty onto us, will it be funded?' So…
26 Ebrill 2023 , Finance Committee
Bil yr Amgylchedd (Ansawdd Aer a Seinweddau) (Cymru)
So, this is really difficult because this depends, as I said—. There used to be joke when I was doing my law exams—Chair, forgive me for telling you it—but we always used to say that credit could be given for writing 'it depends' in the margins, and I kind of…
26 Ebrill 2023 , Finance Committee
Bil yr Amgylchedd (Ansawdd Aer a Seinweddau) (Cymru)
Yes.
26 Ebrill 2023 , Finance Committee
Bil yr Amgylchedd (Ansawdd Aer a Seinweddau) (Cymru)
So, the current requirements in existing legislation are that Welsh Ministers must review and, if appropriate, modify the national air quality strategy every five years. That's from the Environment Act 1995, and it was amended in 2021 by the Environment Act…
26 Ebrill 2023 , Finance Committee
Bil yr Amgylchedd (Ansawdd Aer a Seinweddau) (Cymru)
Yes, and I completely agree with that, and, obviously, we hope the Bill will provide yet another opportunity to do just that.
26 Ebrill 2023 , Finance Committee
Bil yr Amgylchedd (Ansawdd Aer a Seinweddau) (Cymru)
Yes, that's right. And this is a direct public information campaign; it's not particularly directed at schools, although schools will be able to pick up information from this and put it onto Hwb, and so on. But we've had conversations with the education…
26 Ebrill 2023 , Finance Committee
Bil yr Amgylchedd (Ansawdd Aer a Seinweddau) (Cymru)
I couldn't agree more, Mike. And, again, the behaviour change costs in the Bill are very much directed towards a campaign to do just that.
26 Ebrill 2023 , Finance Committee
Bil yr Amgylchedd (Ansawdd Aer a Seinweddau) (Cymru)
Yes, Mike, I couldn't agree more, really, and that's exactly what I was just talking about in my own constituency. As you know—I know you've seen those figures as well—it's about making people understand that their actions affect others, not necessarily right…
26 Ebrill 2023 , Finance Committee
Bil yr Amgylchedd (Ansawdd Aer a Seinweddau) (Cymru)
Well, we think we've made a good estimate—that's the point. I don't want people to think we're just guessing here. These estimates are based on the data that we already have. They're good, professional estimates; they're not just a wet finger in the wind. So…
26 Ebrill 2023 , Finance Committee
Bil yr Amgylchedd (Ansawdd Aer a Seinweddau) (Cymru)
Just on that, Peter, again, I can't emphasise this enough: this Bill is just part of a package of measures. So, there are other things in place as well to do that. This Bill is not intended to be able to do everything and be everything to everyone.
26 Ebrill 2023 , Finance Committee
Bil yr Amgylchedd (Ansawdd Aer a Seinweddau) (Cymru)
I suppose one of the problems we've got is what I was talking about in terms of the data, isn't it? We know that it affects people, we know that it has a very substantive effect on people, but unfortunately we don't have the data to drive the exact…
26 Ebrill 2023 , Finance Committee
Bil yr Amgylchedd (Ansawdd Aer a Seinweddau) (Cymru)
Say the number again that you were quoting at me.
26 Ebrill 2023 , Finance Committee
Bil yr Amgylchedd (Ansawdd Aer a Seinweddau) (Cymru)
Yes. We'll have air quality monitoring stations that are much more specific for the targets that we set. They tend to be more general. They're all published, by the way, on our website. They all have publicly available information. My own constituency, as you…
26 Ebrill 2023 , Finance Committee
Bil yr Amgylchedd (Ansawdd Aer a Seinweddau) (Cymru)
Is that you, Olwen? Or is it Roger again?
26 Ebrill 2023 , Finance Committee
Bil yr Amgylchedd (Ansawdd Aer a Seinweddau) (Cymru)
I don't know if you want to talk about the existing network, Olwen. Again, I'm sorry, but all of these things are just ridiculously complicated, really, Peter.
